We enter the conversation in mid-stream where the bombastic glam rock Guns and Roses group of last century is being discussed. MooPig took a front position with a more severe bombastic stance to guild out guile and ferver of commentators: Read the Post HERE --
MooPig's Pat Darnell...But, but but…. wait a minnit in New York!! or versa vica:
I just came from Sans’ page on the tuning issues… and some other intonation issues… it must be that time of the month. 1-3-5, and concert C, b flat on the B flat clarinet.. …and the subject page at Pribek’s, well forget about it in my universe.
Now, reproduction tech has a flaw: replicate fade — more copies will result in loss of integrity.
I have a had a rough ride through my personal experiences with recorded music history.
Let me explain — Inheriting from my mother… I was born with perfect pitch, but cannot sing perfect pitch.. you know the type, I got half my Mother’s skills and twice as much as you. As I listened to vinyl and then tape then eight track, then cassette in my car, at home… … then I try to tune my guitar to what I am supposing is actual!! Not so. I tuned to exactly the frequencies of the turntable Hifi, etc. It was not to my or my mom’s pleasure. I remained stubbornly self oppressed about it, for a long time.
Wow, I decided some where in time that I am a loser, and will never be able to tune a guitar. I went around grimacing every time I heard Sinatra records, “Man he sings flat!” A lot of people wanted me dead for that.
You see those tapes had a flaw… they were a half step flat. So when I showed up at fellowship with a flat tuned ax, all the people looked at me like I was the last puppy at the pound; respectful but piteous.
When did I discover this? When I heard my first CD. Guess what, Suite Judy Blue Eyes was for the first time ever on pitch to my bloody brain, and I weeped.
How old was I at that time.. about thirty something. I am supposing that digital maintains integrity of tone better than all the other reproduction types.
Now, in the YT subject, everything in the whole presentation is a hodge podge of flatness. Even the drums sound like they’re pushed through the community pool.
I suspect something is amiss with the reproduction. Otherwise I would say the group here has provided a rendition that is worse than its original by GnR. I give this rendition a 1.5 or so… no grievances, just a little sad.
My scale of music appreciation low to high:
1 Grimace
2 Nervous
3 Eyes shut, nasal cavity resonating
4 BTU at normal respiration of 3.14 btu per hour
5 Sporadic Yawning
6 Tingling Sensations from head to foot on one side
7 Tingling “Ditto” on both sides
8 Full frontal body resonating
9 Entire body experiencing to point of dancing in the aisles
10 Converging arts in cranium resulting in visions and edifications
Author: MG Comment:
I like this version, Ovidiu. I thought that flat note might be just that acsending "harmony/root-third thing" he was getting into at that point.? Oh well. Uhhmm...I don't get that Pat Darnell thing-wtf!?”
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Full frontal body resonating”? That sounds a bit disturbing… (Dr J)
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A lot of folks play half a step down, if you think about it. Actually while in GnR, Slash did the same and here I guess he had no reason to change it. Plus that is easier for the singer and has a lower tension in strings, which gives a nice sound to the guitar, if you listen to his guitar sound, I think the low tension in the string due to that half step down tune is also responsible for this.
@Dr J: looking closely, indeed, Slash takes a F instead of a F# in D, you would have said that after all those years such mistakes are not easy to make, buy hey, we are all human, I guess nobody could say never played a flat note, right? I know it happened to me 
The interesting part is that he didn’t seem bothered by this and let this recording when I guess he could have taken another one.
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It’s like this MG, I’m making a statement about quality :
:this is and example of Ax’s only mentioned musical influence: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1c196_new-gospel-family_music
:notice any similarities in the soloists and Axl?? Just screw down GnR stuff and there it is.
The performers today, who have no musical talent like GnR, play a half step flat because they grew up copying tapes that are always technically inferior repro’s. Dupes, Duds, and 2% is the game now. I am only judging the performances and the growling going on now is like an amphibian drowning in a vat of alcohol.
And I fully understand that most patrons are tone deaf… but
Screaming and caterwauling is now a trend. My youngsters play the most awful sounding stuff and I ask them is that nice?
That wtf means? why the flats?
Ovidiu is right, the song Patience is absolutely beautiful, and I love its possibility but the out take here and with the original GNr is akin to a Buck Owens performance, the flattest in the West, God forgive them.
Please look at the flatness factor as a high priority. The rhythm guitar seems off on two strings, tambourine is off on some tempo…
This argument of mine comes from a long time love/hate relationship with Rock, and these guys are eat up bad. Usually a flat or sharp in a band situation is a “look at me” tactic, “I’m the solo act all the others are just clowns.”
I am suggesting the flat fault theory is a de-evolutionary quirk, that most quality experts in other industries would stop the production lines.. no?
Do you drive a Honda with flat tires?
(pd/ 24 - 27 July 2008 wtf)
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